DEQ-CFW_00081949

8-9-2017 Interview Transcript
3:18 Interviewer: Okay so, GenX. Well, first of all let's start with Chemours. What you guys know about
itand how long they've been inthe state.
3: 24 Secretary Regan: Chemours has been in the state ... I don't know how long Chemours has been in
the state.
3:30Interviewer: That's okay, this isall edited.
3:33 Sec. Regan: So, Chemours is a spinoff of Dupont Chemical Company. They've had a permit in the
state, I believe, since 1977. It's a chemical manufacturing company that creates coatings and contributes
to products like Teflon.
3:49 Interviewer: Gotcha, okay. So, 6enX. Nobody even really heard of this orthought to hear about
this other than the generation of people known as GenX until this. What can you tell me about this
chemical?
3:57 Sec. Regan: |t'sa pretty unknown chemical. GenX has been on the market for a while but there's
not a lot of details about the chemical. It's part of a manufacturing process and has been discharged in
the Cape Fear River aspart ofabyproduct.
4:I4Interviewer: When did the state first hear about GenX?
4:17 Sec. Regan: The state heard about GenX through a report, a study done by North Carolina State
and the United States Environmental Protection Agency.
4:25 Interviewer: Okay. What was the initial reaction when you first heard about this?
4:29 Sec. Regan: When I first heard about it, the initial reaction for me was to focus on what GenX was
and what the impact was. We first learned about GenX, I first learned about GenX in June, upon hearing
about that, the Governor took very swift action once we understood that it was being discharged to the
Cape Fear River. Number one, he directed our agencies to approach this issue as if we were drinking the
water and our families were drinking this water. And number two, to redirect all of our resources
towards this issue. So, that's what we did. The Department of Environmental Quality and the
Department of Health and Human Services launched an investigation to best determine number one,
what is GenX? Two: where is it being discharged from? And too, we sought to have the company
decease the release ofGenX into the [ape Fear River. We instituted an aggressive monitoring program
so that we could be sure that the company actually did cease the discharge of GenX. And number four,
we have indicated that we will deny the company's request to continue to release GenX into the Cape
Fear River.
5:37 Interviewer: Gotcha. And I want to get to more of that in a minute. Let's just talk about the safety,
what you guys have found so far. A lot of people, especially in Wilmington not so much here but they
are hearing about it, when they found out it was in the drinking water supply, small amounts, should
they beworried?
5:52 Sec. Regan: At this juncture, we have set a health goal. And based on the analysis that we've done
so far, the concentrations ofGenX in the water are well below that health goal. So, we believe that the
public should feel comfortable drinking the water atthis juncture.
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6:11Interviewer: Gotcha.Ofcourse, the goal though istoeliminate it, from anenvironmental
standpoint?
6:15 Sec. Regan: Yes. Our conversation has been that number one, we have asked the company to
discontinue their release until we have more information about this chemical of concern. And two, we
are denying in their permit application their requirement to release GenX into the Cape Fear River.
6:37Interviewer: Go0cha. So, let's Botoback tothat report when itwas first discovered. It's been
released. First of all, based on your research how long do you think GenX has been being released into
the river?
6:47 Sec. Regan: GenX has been released into the river since the 1980's. The company had established a
consent decree with the United States Environmental Protection Agency in 2009. The state did not have
knowledge of the consent decree. And so, through Dr. Knappe's study, the state reached out to Dr.
Knappe to better understand the study. And sort of what the analysis in the study meant.
7:15 Interviewer: And from an outsider, why wouldn't the State know/ about something like that? Stuff
being pumped into North Carolina rivers.
7:20 Sec. Regan: That's part of our investigation. My department has launched an investigation to best
determine if the chemical compound was adequately disclosed in the permit. Chemical compounds like
GenX often 8o by a number ofdifferent variations or names so sometimes it is difficult to nail down the
specific nature of the chemical compound. Which is why we've decided that moving forward in our
permitting process, we will require some advanced monitoring and advanced disclosure so that we can
better ascertain the appropriate level of information about the chemical compounds of concern.
8:03 Interviewer: It's almost situation it seemed like something that's not, it was never regulated, am |
correct? From my understanding.
8:09 Sec. Regan: It is an unregulated chemical compound. It's not regulated at the state level nor is it
regulated atthe federal level.
8:15 Interviewer: So, it was almost a situation where you have an unregulated, well it is, a situation
where you have this unregulated compound. How doyou know what to regulate if you don't know what
aU'sout there? What's the next GenX?How dow/egoabout addressing that?
8:27 Sec. Regan: There are a couple ways. The first is, the Governor has expanded our science advisory
board. So, we're going to have a board of experts, epidemiologists, medical doctors, scientists, people
who are well versed inthis area, to partner with the North Carolina Department of Environmental
Quality and the United States Environmental Protection Agency to better understand the emerging
chemical compounds that m/eshould beprioritizing.
8:55 Interviewer: Do you think a lot of this responsibility falls to the manufacturers of these compounds,
the companies who are coming here and putting it in the water? Are they required at this point to
disclose everything that they are putting inthe water?
9:06 Sec. Regan: Companies are required to disclose what they're putting in to our water. What we are
going to do a better job of is providing a level of specificity on the level of disclosure that we at the State
level expect.
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9:21Interviewer: Okay. Let's 8oback tothe moment you found out about the report. It's now inthe
water. There were calls from several county commissioners, from the mayor of Wilmington, to stop
dumping the water immediately. That couldn't be done. Why not? Why couldn't the State immediately
from that day, as soon as they found out that this was in the water and that nobody really knew what it
was, stop them from dumpin8GenX into the river?
9:43 Secretary Regan: Number one, the Governor took very swift action and directed that we began an
investigation. Shortly after we began that investigation, the company voluntarily discontinued dumping
the unregulated chemical compound into the water. Because the chemical compound is unregulated,
there is a gray area in terms of how quickly and swiftly we can mandate that the company ceases
discharge. But again, we launched an investigation and through that investigation, the company decided
tocease discharge ofthe GenXchemical compound.
10:23 Interviewer: Gotcha. Okay, let's talk about cleanup. Right now, the goal is to get them to zero
percent dumping into the water. What do you do with the GenX that's already in the river?
10:32 Sec. Regan: What we plan to do is number one, continue to monitor. I think we are trying to
better understand some of the residual amounts that are there and how long it would take for those
residual amounts tobecompletely gone. So, goal number one istodeny the request tocontinue the
discharge. Goal two is to continue to monitor and study and best determine, number one if there's a
natural course of action by which we can take that the residuals would be gone in a decent amount of
time or two, if we are going to be in the situation where we need to mandate some mediational action.
11:14 Interviewer: Have there been talks, this is more from an economics standpoint of things, I know
you guys are environment, but is there a concern that what does a company do when they're denied
access todowhat they've been doing?
21:25 Sec. Regan: When we launched our investigation and when we requested that they cease the
discharge, the company did cease discharge. | am under the impression and the assumption that that
can bedone. And | have the expectation that they will continue toduthat.
11:45 Interviewer: You guys are asking for more money for your budget. First, tell me generally how
much, what it's going to8ofor, and why it's important.
11:53 Sec. Regan: Over the past 8 to 10 years, this agency has seen a significant reduction in funding
that would support programs that not only issue permits, but look at compliance and enforcement and
the science that goes behind setting these standards. We've seen a decrease of about 70 employees,
approximately 70 employees, over the last 8 to 9 years. We're not asking for that amount. What we're
asking for are resources sothat w/e can hire engineers, scientists, permit writers, to help us do two
things. The first is to help us better understand how to regulate chemical compounds, like GenX and
some of the other emerging compounds, but two, also help close some of the 40 percent gap that we
have in reissuing permits. Right now, we have a bout a two year wait period for those who are looking to
re -up their permits. So, there are two things in play here. The first is insuring that w/e protect the quality
ofour drinking water for all North Carolinians. But the second is that we keep pace with a growing
economy and that we're able to re=issue permits that are done correctly in an adequate time.
13:08 Interviewer: Tell me about, there was this agreement with the EPA and I know that's not your
section, but do you think there was proper communication between the federal division and the state
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level when it comes to these emerging compounds? Is there enough communication to be like "we
made an agreement this is something that you need to know about"? From a viewer's perspective, if I
hear that there's this chemical that's unregulated that the EPA knows about, myquestion iswhy didn't
the EPA come to the State and say "here's something you need to know that's being pumped into your
river".
I3x44Sec Regan: Sure. Part of our investigation is to determine what the answer is to that question. I
believe that there are always opportunities to improve communication. But, the investigation will lead
ustowhere there was a lack ofcommunication, where there could have been possible lack of
disclosure, and how w/e remedy this action moving forward.
14:06 Interviewer: So, what would you say is the biggest takeaway. Would you call this a scare, with
how things were handled? The situation itself, GenX, another compound actually in the drinking water
overall how would you just describe this situation?
14:21Sec Regan: | would say that this administration took very swift action. | would say that xvewere
notified in June of GenX. In June, we began an investigation. In June, we began very aggressive
monitoring. In June, we demanded that the company ceased the discharge of GenX. And in the month of
June, we also reestablished the Science Advisory Board so that we could begin to not only look at the
short'termaddreuuin8ofthisissue,buta|uobe0intothinkaboutthe|on0er-termapproachtoGenXand
other chemical compounds that may beufconcern.
14:57Interviewer: And water testing bcontinual, correct?
15J00 Sec Regan: Water testing condnues. In some areas, we are testing on aw/eeWy basis. In some
areas, we are testing on a daily basis. We continue to see the concentrations of GenX trend downward.
So, we feel really, really good about the aggressive actions that we've taken thus far. But there's still
more work to do. And we plan to approach this issue as if our families were drinking this water and in
many cases, our families, members ufour staff, are drinking this water. So, we take the protection of
water quality very seriously.
15:29 Interviewer: You talked about having a panel of these experts that can talk about these emerging
compounds that are unknown. When do you want to see all this happen? Of course, the sooner the
better, but when can we realistically see these protections in place?
25;43Sec Regan: We have reconstituted the Science Advisory Board and right now we are in the
process ofrecruiting those board members. We anticipate that this Science Advisory Board will be
meeting at the end of August or early September to begin this work. This is a very important issue for us.
We're redirecting all resources that xve need to to be sure that we're protecting the water quality for
North Carolina.
16:10|ntervieoxer And then, as basically asyou can, this is more for background for me, tell me how
that permitting process works. When a company, when Chemours came in, they said "Okay, we need to
pump into the river". What was looked for and what were they permitted to do?
26:27 Sec. Regan: Chemours sought a wastewater discharge permit. As part of that application permit,
they're required to disclose unregulated as well as regulated. The level of disclosure for regulated
pollutants is much more rigorous. For the unregulated chemical compounds, there's a supplemental
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section. And that's where this unregulated chemical compound would have been recognized as part of
the permit process.
26:53|n1ervieuwer: Okay, was itlisted in that? Based ontheir initial permit, did they list GenXintheir
unregulated section?
17:02Sec Regan: That's part ofour investigation. The question is, "is this chemical compound
adequately identified inthe permit proce*s?" Again, these chemical compounds can berecognized by
various names and by various |D/s. but vvewant to do a thorough investigation to be sure that xve
understand whether or not this chemical compound was adequately disclosed. And we hope to do that
because as state agency, xvewant to be sure that we're taking every action possible to protect the
water quality for North Carolina.
17:37 Interviewer: Is there anything else? | think that you covered everything | need. Anything |'m not
asking that you think is important for anyone who is drinking the water or just looking at this from our
neck ofthe woods?
17x46Sec Regan: I think it's important for our fellow citizens to be comfortable drinking the water. We
are doing rigorous testing. We believe that the water is safe to drink. But that's a personal choice. |
would drink the water. | have been drinking the water during myvisits to Wilmington. And so, we
believe that people should feel comfortable drinking the water and we'll continue to apply pressure to
besure that the water quality is protected for all North Carolina citizens.
18:16 Interviewer: This is kind of a big question, but ultimately you look at this happened, you've gotten
to the drinking water, I know it's part of the investigation but based on what you've found, who
ultimately should be held accountable for this potential risk?
28:28Sec Regan: The company will be held accountable if we find any violations as it pertains to this
investigation.
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