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Home My WebLink About20090372 Ver 1_Other Agency Comments_20081121e„a 57ATE u4t-1 y°M ??Q pwu ?• STATE OF NORTH CAROLINA DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION MICHAEL F EASLEY LYNDO TIPPETT GOVERNOR SECRETARY November 21, 2008 MEMORANDUM TO FILE FROM Robert Bamer 40V..1W- Engineering Associate Project Development and Environmental Analysis Branch SUBJECT Stormwater Issues Regarding Proposed NC 210 (Murchison Road) Improvements, TIP Project U-4444 A meeting was held on November 21, 2008 for the proposed project The purpose of the meeting was to discuss stormwater issues on the project The following persons, were in attendance Jay McInnis Robert Barrier Marshall Clawson Chris Militscher Rob Ridings Max Price Glen Prillaman (via phone) Lee Ward (via phone) NCDOT Project Development and Environmental Analysis Branch NCDOT Project Development and Environmental Analysis Branch NCDOT Hydraulics Unit Environmental Protection Agency NC Division of Water Quality Weatherill Engineering Fort Bragg Master Planning Fort Bragg Stormwater Max Price explained that he had begun looking at ways to treat stormwater near Little Cross Creek Chris Milrtscher explained that if tributaries are present, it must be insured that there are no impairments to the 303d stream Mr Price mentioned that Cross Creek is several miles away from project Mr Ridings informed the group that unnamed tributaries carry the same designation as the main stream Mr Militscher added that regulations regarding impaired streams also apply to their tributaries He further discussed that he understands it is hard to provide treatment for this project due to land and environmental constraints MAILING ADDRESS TELEPHONE 919-733-3141 LOCATION NC DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION FAX 919-733-9794 TRANSPORTATION BUILDING PROJECT DEVELOPMENT AND ENVIRONMENTAL ANALYSIS 1 SOUTH WILMINGTON STREET 1548 MAIL SERVICE CENTER WEBSITE WWW DOH DOT STATE NC US RALEIGH NC RALEIGH NC 27699-1548 Page 2 of 2 U-4444 Mmutes It was noted that the wetland west of Murchison is not of very high quality Mr Militscher suggested building a stormwater retention basin in the wetland Mr Price explained that he had considered a basin, and had calculated a basin size to treat the first inch of runoff from the pavement only, while initially diverting other runoff through the grassed swales and wetlands He mentioned that offsrte runoff flows through the two ideal locations for a basin, and that channeling the offsrte runoff around them would cause additional environmental impacts If the offsrte runoff is not diverted, then the basin would be very large, also causing additional environmental impacts Mr Price explained he had an alternative to building a basin He suggested instead of tying the median inlets on the high (west) side to a pipe system, the median inlets will carry the water to outlets on the west side of the road into a grassed ditch or natural swales This will provide some treatment of the stormwater before it reaches Little Cross Creek Mr Ridings and Mr Militscher agreed with Mr Price's suggestion, winch would create more outlets on the west side than otherwise Mr Ridings asked if preformed scour holes would be used at the roadside outfalls Mr Price explained that due to the topography, preformed scour holes would not work any better than energy pads Mr Ridings then asked about check dams Mr Price explained check dams might pose a hazard since the shoulder width has been reduced to, six feet 1 .1 It was emphasized that a commitment be added to the FONSI regarding treatment Mr Militscher asked about the drainage design at the proposed Randolph Street interchange Mr Price suggested putting three cross pipes under Ramp A at Randolph Street to prevent draining the wetland on cemetery property, then providing an energy dissipater pad in the wetland outside of the loop Mr Militscher responded that he does not like energy dissipaters in wetlands He asked if the dissipater could go inside of the loop Mr Price explained that the outfall velocity is governed by pipe size, thus interior treatment would not reduce outfall velocities Mr Price mentioned that the existing concrete paved ditches will be replaced with grassed ditches throughout the project These ditches will probably be reinforced with fabric It was mentioned that EPA and DWQ do not recommend burying pipes at Randolph Street because these crossings are at the headwaters of the stream and that it would drain the wetland at the cemetery Also, it was said that NCDOT cannot further impair an already impaired stream, and that NCDOT must display an effort towards impact mitigation